EGR Blanking Plate - Advanatges/Disadvantages

[leffelou]

My first post on the forum (Hello guys - and girls!). I've seen the EGR valve blanking kits advertised on a few specialists websites, what benefit does this have and what are the downsides (emissions etc etc).

[micheal]

the benifits are that the engine should run cleaner the inter cooler stays cleaner longer (once cleaned) and releases slightly more power due to the engine getting more colder air then having exausht gasses going into it
as for mot emmisons dont worry theres loads of land rovers out there with this mod fitted to them and they pass the mot. so its well worth doing
p.s if you havent already decatt your car (if it has one fitted) thats another good mod to do

[thebiglad]

the benifits are that the engine should run cleaner the inter cooler stays cleaner longer (once cleaned) and releases slightly more power due to the engine getting more colder air then having exausht gasses going into it
as for mot emmisons dont worry theres loads of land rovers out there with this mod fitted to them and they pass the mot. so its well worth doing
p.s if you havent already decatt your car (if it has one fitted) thats another good mod to do


Hi Micheal, if you considor the routing of the EGR plumbing, taking into effect the sucking action of the inlet manifold and the boost pressure of the turbo, you may come to the same conclusion as me that there are NO exhaust gases going through the intercooler, so no clagging-up from that source.

It would be correct to say that exhaust gases do re-enter the inlet manifold, but that does not reduce the cooled air passing through the intercooler, as the EGR gases only enter the induction circuit AFTER the 'cooler.

This is in no way intended to put anyone off doing a De-EGR job, as the benefits far out the only negative which is to move away from being a std vehicle. The engine will run cleaner, therefore better. De-EGR & De-Catt are imo the two best mods you can do to a TDi 300.

[micheal]

my apologies mate

[thebiglad]

my apologies mate

No probs at all Micheal.

It just seems funny that in the last few days, this slight misunderstanding of how EGR operates has cropped up loads.

Didn't mean to have a pop at you, I'm just an akward old bûgger who likes to get things accurate, if at all possible.

[micheal]

hey that aint no worries mate i dont mind being corrected at least i know mate for the fueture

[thebiglad]

hey that aint no worries mate i dont mind being corrected at least i know mate for the future



Taking it on the chin - good bloke !!!

[micheal]

thats me mate i dont mind i dont know everything and i dont profess to know but i do know some stuff

[thebiglad]

thats me mate i dont mind i dont know everything and i dont profess to know but i do know some stuff


We all gotta learn stuff.

Today with a pal I took the gearbox/transferbox off my wife's TDi 300 to resolve a clutch problem - basically there was no clutch anymore !!!

I thought I knew what it might be so I go all the spare parts in stock before starting the job. I was very nervous because to me, doing it on the basis of diy and axle stands, I felt it was going to be quite a challenge.

We took our time, stripped the exhaust and propshafts away to make working room and then proceded to undo the bellhousing nuts and bolts.

Don't want to bore you but - it's done !!!!!! The problem was a perforated clutch fork and we had the old one out and a new (HD) one in and refitted within the day. I must say I was VERY relieved.

So tomorrow, it will be putting everything back together and then hopefully, a succesful test drive.

Every day we have the opportunity to learn new stuff - do we always take it???


The best of luck to you matey

Cheers
Dave

[micheal]

congrats on the clutch mate very well done my granddad used to say that what we know will fill a book and what we didnt know would fill a libary

[thebiglad]

congrats on the clutch mate very well done my granddad used to say that what we know will fill a book and what we didnt know would fill a libary



Your grandad is/was very wise :D:D:D

[micheal]

he was mate passed away when i was nine but thats the one saying that will stay with me forever and its very true mate
micheal

[jumpy]

My first post on the forum (Hello guys - and girls!). I've seen the EGR valve blanking kits advertised on a few specialists websites, what benefit does this have and what are the downsides (emissions etc etc).

Just blanked off the egr valve on mine recently - mot is due up end of this month and I'm confident that blanking off the egr will make no difference. Besides which, all the oil and filters will be renewed before mot anyway so engine ought to be in good condition.

Few other jobs worthwhile doing at the same time:
1) clean intercooler
2) clean inlet manifold

I used 4L of white spirit from B&Q to wash/soak the parts with.
The intercooler was pretty clean, but the inlet manifold was coated in a thick layer of tary black sticky gunk (no problem for the solvent power of the white spirit though :cool: ).
A good soak in WS and the use of an old bottle brush for the inlet manifold and everything came out nice and clean compared to how it had been before. Both the inlet and the intercooler were rinsed with lots of running water, then left to soak in soapy water overnight (just to be safe).

Following some good advice from thebiglad, I thoroughly dried the inlet and in particular the intercooler (after air-drying over the weekend, the other half's hair-dryer came in use for this) - it's amazing how hot the intercooler got just from using her hair-dryer on the openings - after about 5-10 minutes it was too hot to touch, just from a bit of hot air!!

Perhaps it's the placebo effect but he car feels better to drive, seems to pick up a little quicker than it used to, and I have the knowledge that there's no more nasty sticky crap being fed back into the engine.
Worth noting too: the ports into the cylinder head behind the inlet manifold were also coated in a layer of gunk - I carefully used an old feeler blade to scrape some of the muck off.

As for the kits themselves: there's a few to choose from - some include new silicone pipes and run from about 15 quid upwards, whilst others (like mine) just have the plate, gasket and some new bolts. Mine was ~£5 from paddocks.
All I did with mine (for now) was put the blanking plate and gasket in the join between the egr valve and the metal inlet feed 1" dia pipe and left everything else in place (see attachment). I'll remove the valve properly at some later date.

[som]

i used a egr removal kit from td5 alive had its first mot with it on yesterday.got a fast pass on the emissions,and im sure the engine pulls better low down

[leffelou]

Just blanked off the egr valve on mine recently - mot is due up end of this month and I'm confident that blanking off the egr will make no difference. Besides which, all the oil and filters will be renewed before mot anyway so engine ought to be in good condition.

Few other jobs worthwhile doing at the same time:
1) clean intercooler
2) clean inlet manifold

I used 4L of white spirit from B&Q to wash/soak the parts with.
The intercooler was pretty clean, but the inlet manifold was coated in a thick layer of tary black sticky gunk (no problem for the solvent power of the white spirit though :cool: ).
A good soak in WS and the use of an old bottle brush for the inlet manifold and everything came out nice and clean compared to how it had been before. Both the inlet and the intercooler were rinsed with lots of running water, then left to soak in soapy water overnight (just to be safe).

Following some good advice from thebiglad, I thoroughly dried the inlet and in particular the intercooler (after air-drying over the weekend, the other half's hair-dryer came in use for this) - it's amazing how hot the intercooler got just from using her hair-dryer on the openings - after about 5-10 minutes it was too hot to touch, just from a bit of hot air!!

Perhaps it's the placebo effect but he car feels better to drive, seems to pick up a little quicker than it used to, and I have the knowledge that there's no more nasty sticky crap being fed back into the engine.
Worth noting too: the ports into the cylinder head behind the inlet manifold were also coated in a layer of gunk - I carefully used an old feeler blade to scrape some of the muck off.

As for the kits themselves: there's a few to choose from - some include new silicone pipes and run from about 15 quid upwards, whilst others (like mine) just have the plate, gasket and some new bolts. Mine was ~£5 from paddocks.
All I did with mine (for now) was put the blanking plate and gasket in the join between the egr valve and the metal inlet feed 1" dia pipe and left everything else in place (see attachment). I'll remove the valve properly at some later date.

Thanks Jumpy, looks like im going to be busy next weekend!

[ruckinfight]

Hi I have just done the EGR on mine I changed to a de-cat front pipe and a silencer replacment pipe at the same time my disco has done 186.000 miles and it pulls like brand new

[micheal]

good stuff mate its good to here that its worked
micheal

[js5d]

Lots of good reasons have been given, but I am interested in the downsides as well. Fair enough Exhaust Gas Recirculation is fitted for NOX emissions, which most likely is not having much effect on performance.

But I can image that LR has mapped the EGR in the computer, removing it must either make the comp to compensate (that would be good) or simple under or overfuel affecting fuel consumption.

EGR is mainly effective at low power I understand so maybe idle is less fuel efficient?

We need a automotive engineer to explain this to us.

[micheal]

enter me lol
the egr system was to allow the gases to enter the system to be reburnt hence the name it was designed for the countrys with more strict emmisons regulations
all that you are doing is lowering the inlet tempreture and allowing cleaner air in to the system the colder denser air the better the burn.
i dont think that the computer would be affected if any thing unplug the throttle position sensor then the computer becomes redundent
i hope i got that right

[leffelou]

Well i've ordered an EGR blanking kit ( and some new turbo hoses as the originals were looking pretty poor with some cracks in them when squeezed) so an intercooler and manifold clean will be done at the same time. Was looking at the decat pipe too, do they really make that much of a difference to power? Not expecting Sierra Cosworth power but a bit of extra grunt would be nice as really steep hills tend to kill the power completely, or do you think i should do the other jobs listed first to see if the power picks up again? Its not horrendously bad & sits quite comfortably at 70 -75 on the motorway but it doesn't have that same "go" as other 300TDi's i've driven & once you have a loaded trailer behind it struggles a bit.

[micheal]

silcone hoses are the best

[leffelou]

silcone hoses are the best


Thats what i've gone for micheal, hopefully they should last a long time as we don't intend getting rid of it for a very long time. My fiancee's owned it six years and has got very attached to it whereas i was never a fan of 4x4's before (I've had the misfortune of driving Isuzu Troopers and Pajero's on occasion - not through choice though !) but the old Discovery has really impressed me - basic, rugged enough to last a lifetime & very nice to drive ....... I've been converted !

[micheal]

good to hear that mate i bought mine 18 mnths ago for 500 quid and ive got it some where near to where i want it now you could always go the full hog and fit a full size intercooler

[micheal]

mine has a list of bits fitted to it
de catt pipe full size intercooler centre box replacment pipe silicone hoses de egr turbo adjusted up ebc pads and slotted and drilled discs all round k&n air filter (panel type )

[thebiglad]

Lots of good reasons have been given, but I am interested in the downsides as well. Fair enough Exhaust Gas Recirculation is fitted for NOX emissions, which most likely is not having much effect on performance.

But I can image that LR has mapped the EGR in the computer, removing it must either make the comp to compensate (that would be good) or simple under or overfuel affecting fuel consumption.

EGR is mainly effective at low power I understand so maybe idle is less fuel efficient?

We need a automotive engineer to explain this to us.


The EGR system, when new, was designed to operate only in certain conditions, such as light throttle load, to pass the then current emissions legislation. Unfortunately over time this plan goes awry and the valve often sticks open allow the exhaust gases to recirculate all the time.

On TDi 300 manual gearbox models there is no ECU so no 'central control" as such.

On TDi 300 auto, there is an ECU but the EGR valve has no electronics attaching to it so cannot be under the control of the ECU.

I understand that you wanted to get a "pros and cons" of the EGR valve and it's operation, but believe me when I say there are no downsides to taking it off, only upsides. It was a daft design poorly executed.

[ruckinfight]

I put the de-cat pipe and the silencer replacement pipe on before I did my EGR and the pipes my a great difference I did the EGR it doesnt make it go like a cosworth do you will tell the difference, Hills where I live I used to be down to second gear but now it sails up in forth

[Scottmurray2890]

Do you need to get the blanking plate or do can you jusut unplug the blighter?

[thebiglad]

Do you need to get the blanking plate or do can you jusut unplug the blighter?


It needs to be blanked off as the valve often sticks open so the only sure way of knowing that you don't have egr anymore is to physically blank it off.

[23skidoo]

Lots of good reasons have been given, but I am interested in the downsides as well. Fair enough Exhaust Gas Recirculation is fitted for NOX emissions, which most likely is not having much effect on performance.

But I can image that LR has mapped the EGR in the computer, removing it must either make the comp to compensate (that would be good) or simple under or overfuel affecting fuel consumption.

EGR is mainly effective at low power I understand so maybe idle is less fuel efficient?

We need a automotive engineer to explain this to us.

Not an engineer but I too have a slight concern about how the ECU reacts to EGR removal . It certainly logs the permenant stuck open state as a FAULT on my ECU . I wouldnt for one minute suggest NOT doing it , but would like to find some way to NOT have a fault logged , feel more comforatable with it as 100% good rather than 99% .:)

[rickyrooo1]

Can the mods be done on a td5? Have i read somewhere people even remove the centre silencer too? To clarify, can i remove the egr the cat and some of the exhaust? Wont it be really noisy?

[Scottmurray2890]

Your back box stops most of the noise, the cat is mostly for emissions.

[Scottmurray2890]

It needs to be blanked off as the valve often sticks open so the only sure way of knowing that you don't have egr anymore is to physically blank it off.

Ok mate thanks.

[Sandy M.]

I bought a shiny big EGR removal kit for my 300Tdi , fitted it and de-catted the 'zorst. Went for a drive and found no noticable difference to the power/torque :o.

There was slight increase in 'turbo whistle' at low revs :).

But that was all :(

[Scottmurray2890]

£40 notes wasted then in your opinion?

[Sandy M.]

£40 notes wasted then in your opinion?

Yes and No!

It showed that the original EGR valve was obviously working fine, but now I didn't need to worry about it going belly up in years to come :rolleyes::rolleyes:.

The De-cat was done with a hacksaw, mig welder and a leftover length of tube from building an exhaust for the racer :) 30 mins work and £0.00.

[Scottmurray2890]

Haha, wish i had the tolls and i would do the same mate.

ill give it a go, i also got some redex to throw into her, im knocking off all the jobs 1 by one and there are loads!