Cycle lanes

[toppa]

Coming into woking where i live, the roads are quite narrow and go through the bush. There is lovely cycle lane on the side of the road, the ones that are combined with the foot path, and yet you still get PRATTS on bike cycling in the traffic lane, risking themselves as its a 50mph road and looses light very early this time of year. This is a pet hate of mine...PRATTS.

Are they required to use the cycle lane if provided??

Cheers

[Dave-H]

Nope - perfectly entitled to use the public highway [unless it's a class of road prohibited to them, motorways, etc]
I ride to work on a bike - but there again you already know i'm a pratt!!!:D

[timbott]

There is lovely cycle lane on the side of the road, the ones that are combined with the foot path,

Are they required to use the cycle lane if provided??

Cheers

Nope, but I wish we were, and the same for pedestrians, they walk all over the cycleways and get a right strop on with us cyclist when rattled:(

cheers, Tim

[toppa]

Dnt get me wrong i dont hate cyclists, i cycle aswell, but i think its a case of there is as safe lane provided, use it!!!!!
PRATTS......

CHeers

[Rich_P]

The very rare and few cycle lanes I see here, usually put you in the gutter, which is not where you ideally should cycle.

[shrek]

As a keen cyclist, cycling hundreds of miles a year I was campaigning for cycle lanes 6 years ago to be seperate from the main highway, and not the red striped ones that form part of the footpath. Cycles and pedestrians don't mix. Cycles and cars don't mix.
Sustainable transport policy? Paint half the footpath red or the gutter of the road red! :rolleyes:

[DEANO3528]

Pay no road tax, got no rights!

That should get some discussion going, and yes that is my - not at all humble - opinion!:eek:

[fisha]

but i pay road tax on 2 cars. if i chose to cycle, does that mean i subsequently do not have rights on the road?

[Rich_P]

but i pay road tax on 2 cars. if i chose to cycle, does that mean i subsequently do not have rights on the road?
In the eyes of the government, yes, you do not have rights on the road if you are a cyclist. :(

I would love to be able to cycle to school and back, but there are various reasons I cannot.

Firstly, traffic is terrible, and you're very likely to get knocked down by a car when on a bike with the amount of traffic in the morning, and secondly, there is no bloody place to safely store the bike at school.

But my main fear of cycling on the roads, if that I could be knocked down by a stupid motorist. I have heard and seen many incidents where a cyclist gets injured because of a bad driver. My grandfather is a keen cyclist, and he also gets the cycling magazine(s), and often there would be a report on someone getting knocked down every now and then, or how cyclists are treated as though they have no right to be on the roads or public footpaths.

[shrek]

Pay no road tax, got no rights!

That should get some discussion going, and yes that is my - not at all humble - opinion!:eek:

Road tax doesn't exist!
We pay a motor vehicle excise duty that gives us a licence to use a motorised vehicle on the road. Without that we have no rights to even keep a motor vehicle on the road.

Historically, whether introducing a road tax for all vehicles would have been a good idea, or could in any way be collected is debatable. Certainly if road users were to pay the true and total cost of motoring per vehicle through a duty system it would price most private motorists off the road.

Do cyclists have rights on the road. In law yes. In modern road culture certainly not.

So what is a proposal?

Create a duty system for cyclists and give them the same rights of adequate safety provision, traffic control systems etc as motor vehicles.

Tax all road users directly for the true cost of using the road.

Ban cyclists from roads

Scrap Vehicle excise duty and increase income taxes

?????????

As has been said already if we pay for a road licence on two vehicles would we like to pay it on cycles as well. Is it per household, member of the household, what age????

I predict insurance is next. Policies are readily available and many regular cyclists have these. A legal requirement would in principle be a good idea but policing it? we can't even do that with cars.

[Lighting90]

Several things bother me about some cyclists...

One, incorrect use of lighting, or no lighting at all, when driving you need to watch for everything around you, a cyclist without lights is so difficult to see, esp as they have a habbit of cutting down the inside of you as you are turning left, with clear indication.
The flashing rear light, great idea, but so many cyclist use this as the only means of lighting, bad idea, legally they still require to have a constant red light.

Cyclists not signally their intentions, and then getting upset with car drivers who go past them, namely the turning right situation.

Cyclists who do not obey the road markings, and swap lanes at random, crossing other traffic, including fellow cyclists, as they are only looking forward, and forget what is behind them... (seen too cyclists collide in front of me two days ago because of this... the one following had no chance to do anything but hit the other guy as it all happened far to quick, )

Cyclists in Edinburgh do not generally obey the traffic lights.. and cross when red, which can make turning etc difficult for you who do have the right to be travelling through the lights on a green light. (this the police seem to be clampping down on and have seen two cyclists pulled over by police cars for doing that)

We seem to have a culture of cyclists out there who seem to think they are above the law, I personally obey the rules when ever I am out on the road with my cycle, why can't these others. All they do is alienate all cyclists to all other road users. You can see it coming in the future the groups forming against cyclists in cities... this will happen is a cyclist causes the death of a child, and at the speeds of these cyclists go at down the hills in Edinburgh it may happen sooner rather than later here...

[SVENUK]

It's Winter time the nights are drawing in and probably 80/90 % of cyclists have no lights.
If they cause an accident because of a driver swerving , who pays the bill.
If i knock a cyclist down because he has no lights - who foots the bill.
It will be me not the bloody cyclist unless i sue them personally
Why should cyclists be able to go onthe hightway without a form of insurance /test.
Personally i would ban anything on two wheels from the highway. I fed up with them weaving in and out of traffic, inside /outside because they are to bloody impatient to wait in the que like the rest of us.
I have only one set of eyes not 4 beacause thats what you need to see anything on two wheels
I know there are people on here who have a cycle /motercycle/scootter and i'm sure you are all very good .
But you are in the minority

Sorry rant over

[Jud]

I cycle 20 miles most days to work and back (although as I write the bike is strapped to the back of the Disco in the company car park) and there are about 2 miles of cycle path which Oxfordshire Highways are in the process of installing. Unfortunately these paths have had a limited amount of thought. On the way to work to use one I would actually have to cross the carriageway three times where as staying on the road means that I don't cross it at all. One part they have built uses an old bit of the road that has been by-passed in a dip, this bit of road has been used for storing all sorts of road scrapings over the years and the surface is presently either covered with loose gravel or very slippery rotting leaves. It is therefore more dangerous than cycling on the road. When cycling to and from work I only ever see two others plus one who works at our place. So for four cyclists it seems a huge waste of money.

I would feel safer on a dedicated cycle path/track properly designed and laid out, but in this case even with the drivers who don't appear to see you, the road is safer. If the law required you to use the cycle path I'd be happily breaking it.

Jud

[Lighting90]

I have to say that in Edinburgh 99% of motorcyclists are okay, they will either wait int he queue like the rest of us, or move slowly between traffic, but do not cause problems at the front of the queue, (unlike cyclists, because here in Edinburgh we have big red boxes at a lot of the lights where the cyclist ride into and then hold up the rest of the traffic as they get going...)

The only motorbike riders I have an issue with, and no not the couriers, as they are pretty good here too... but those Pizza Hut riders, they seem to have no road sense at all, including pulling out at speed from behind buses and almost haveing a front impact with me comign the other way... they also tend to ignore red lights too...

[rusty_wingnut]

im still of the ancient view, i will ride wherever, at my own risk. so i wouldnt ride on a 50mph if there was a cycle lane, however if i was to run into a walker id be in deep ****.

to be honest tho i dont really care if i mow someone on me bike, its their fault. :D

as for no rights thing, well all i can say is are you gunna make kids who ride bikes to school pay for tax?? are you f***, i wouldnt had bothered with my bike at that rate. would just go to school with my ma in her 110, and then you would probably moan about that too.

when at uni myself and mate used to try and out accelerate cars, we were pretty quick!!! although as soon as the car got rolling we were lost :(

doughnut

lighting, i use halogens front and back
bike has no reflectors cos its technically a race machine

the road is a mess and i refuse to ride in the gutter. most cyclist are also verty wary of wet drain covers, therefore you have to expect the worse.

dunno tricky subject but its a bit 50/50 lights yeah you should have them but swerving and that isnt the cyclists fault, blame the highways agency, theyre the idiots

[rusty_wingnut]

ah yeah and if you ask me to pay insurance i won't

what next roller bladers? skate boarders?

dont be daft

[shrek]

ah yeah and if you ask me to pay insurance i won't

what next roller bladers? skate boarders?

dont be daft

Daft? :rolleyes: There is a difference between cycles and roller blades/ skate boards. Cyclists can legally use public roads and are covered by the road traffic act!

[rusty_wingnut]

but why make people like myself pay insurance, when i was 17 n was using me bike for school, if you'd said to me pay insurance i woulda sold the bike

its crazy, the ideas are overkill to solve a problem. easier to educate than to punish on a simple issue like this.

if you punish people for having bikes then no one will have them

[toppa]

Maybe insurence is going to far, but otehr vehicles using the highway have to have insurence, tis a good point, if a cyclist swerves out and hits a car, who pays?? My insurence?
Raises a intersting point with insuring a horse though..

CHeeers

[Landyhunter]

If you must have a cycle lane it should be separated from the traffic by a grass or concrete median like they have in the Netherlands and other European countries. A painted line is fine for separating from pedestrians but not cars and lorries.

With modern road culture it too dangerous put cyclists in the same carriageway as motorists. Unfortunately it has been allowed to become part of human nature to dislike, ridicule and speak against any person, religion, opinion or activity or mode of transport that does not conform to an individual's view. It leads to conflict between the parties involved. Applied to this arguement, both drivers and cyclists become so fixated on their own destination/enjoyment that any impediment to acheiving the aforementioned results in conflict in the form of accidents, verbal abuse e.t.c.

Many aspects of life are being consumed in this way ( the anti4x4 movement for one ) and unless everyone wakes up to the fact, this selfish closed minded mentality which created politcal correctness, religious fundamentalism, football hoolganism, I could go on at great length.........


Draw your own conclusions.

To be individual makes us human, the gift of free will. To enforce conformity to any single way only has one result and we see this every day on the news.

Fight war not wars.

[DEANO3528]

I think a horse has to be fairly well insured anyway and they are a dedicated offroader. They shouldn't have to be paying road tax because like tractors they shouldn't be on the bluddy roads!

Good discussion this.:p

[Landyhunter]

On the subject of road tax and taxes on motorists about one third collected is spent on roads and transport. Where does the rest go? To keep roads at the current (admittedly poor) standard we are in effect being charged as motorists two thirds too much. Current motor taxes are a tax on freedom of movement. And then you are charged to park. Charged to move your car and charged to leave it stationary..... go figure.....

Personally I refuse to park anywhere that charges even if its a bit of walk to my destination.

[Landyhunter]

Deano. Tractors shouldn't be on the "bluddy" roads as they impede you from getting to your destination. This your view.

I suggest you re read my earlier post......

...and yes it is a good discussion, its got me going anyway.

[Madoobri]

If you must have a cycle lane it should be separated from the traffic by a grass or concrete median like they have in the Netherlands and other European countries. A painted line is fine for separating from pedestrians but not cars and lorries.

With modern road culture it too dangerous put cyclists in the same carriageway as motorists. Unfortunately it has been allowed to become part of human nature to dislike, ridicule and speak against any person, religion, opinion or activity or mode of transport that does not conform to an individual's view. It leads to conflict between the parties involved. Applied to this arguement, both drivers and cyclists become so fixated on their own destination/enjoyment that any impediment to acheiving the aforementioned results in conflict in the form of accidents, verbal abuse e.t.c.

Many aspects of life are being consumed in this way ( the anti4x4 movement for one ) and unless everyone wakes up to the fact, this selfish closed minded mentality which created politcal correctness, religious fundamentalism, football hoolganism, I could go on at great length.........


Draw your own conclusions.

To be individual makes us human, the gift of free will. To enforce conformity to any single way only has one result and we see this every day on the news.

Fight war not wars.
Eloquently put :)

[SVENUK]

Maybe insurence is going to far, but otehr vehicles using the highway have to have insurence, tis a good point, if a cyclist swerves out and hits a car, who pays?? My insurence?
Raises a intersting point with insuring a horse though..

CHeeers
Insurance is not over the top at all.
If a cyclist hit your car and broke/dented /scratced it ,try getting the money back of them
If as i saw a cyclist came off the pavement and caused a car to swerve into another vehicle, who pays.

To all on here who have posted and are against the idea- remember it could be your Landy and worse still it could be your LIFE.

[toppa]

Very true, how would you get the money back, i thought every mode of transport on the highway needed insurence???
Cheers

[SVENUK]

Still going on
Most people on cycles have no road sense, have never read the highway code ,ignor just about every rule on the highway. i could go on etc...etc....
Test/insurance and not to be sold until you produce both.
And to cap it all expect us to get out of the way and look out for them.and get ****ed of when we do not give them room

[Lighting90]

dunno tricky subject but its a bit 50/50 lights yeah you should have them but swerving and that isnt the cyclists fault, blame the highways agency, theyre the idiots

The accident I saw where the cyclist served in front of the other one had nothing to do with the road, but the fact they saw a gap in the traffic on the other side of the road at a junction we were approaching, it was clear that he was off to go down that junction. The question is, as cyclists don't have insurance, who pays for the damage and how do they get it sorted, as the impact was fairly damaging to both bikes.

Most people will insure a horse as the damage done by them on other road users can be expensive. Plus vet bills can be very expensive working on the oher angle of an uninsured driver hitting you.

Education of cyclists has been mentioned instead of punishment, well maybe it is time for a cycling test which you can take at say 8 years old and then renewed in say 5 years time and is then covered by any other driving license you may obtain.

With regard to insurance, well maybe it is time it is introduced, along with some form of registration plate, so those cyclists who dmage a vehicle and ride off through the traffic can be caught.

Maybe extreme, but you can bet if a car driver does anything remotely against a cyclist the cyclist will have not problem reporting them.

The problem with all of this though is the cost of putting it into action.

Which is why it has not been done, and most likely never will be.

[Newsreader]

For God's sake don;t talk too loudly about taxing bikes, Blair will hear you and set a whole new load of bureaucracy and nanny state in motion :eek:

I think a horse has to be fairly well insured anyway and they are a dedicated offroader. They shouldn't have to be paying road tax because like tractors they shouldn't be on the bluddy roads!

Good discussion this.:p
As Lighting says, people usually insure a horse because of the damage it could do, and vets' bills etc.

Horses shouldn't be on the roads? Well the horses were on the roads a long time before the cars were, that's why they have a right to be there. Apply the same logic to your argument, and 4x4s shouldn't be on greenlanes, they are only there for similar historical reasons. :D Hey everyone, Deano wants 4x4s off green lanes :eek: ;)

Yep, good discussion :)

[shrek]

:)

Horses shouldn't be on the roads? Well the horses were on the roads a long time before the cars were, that's why they have a right to be there.

And so were bicycles. :)

Can we have number plates affixed to the posterior of horses too. :D :D

Yep, it's good discussion. :)

[Newsreader]

Can we have number plates affixed to the posterior of horses too. :D :D
Trouble is they would poo all over it :D Just like they do in the horsebox. Every time I load up a horse, shut the ramp, up goes the tail, and out comes the poo, all down the ramp, lighting board, number plate ... :ill: :rolleyes:

[shrek]

Trouble is they would poo all over it :D Just like they do in the horsebox. Every time I load up a horse, shut the ramp, up goes the tail, and out comes the poo, all down the ramp, lighting board, number plate ... :ill: :rolleyes:

Is it your driving that's a laxative. :p :D :D

[Madoobri]

Trouble is they would poo all over it :D Just like they do in the horsebox. Every time I load up a horse, shut the ramp, up goes the tail, and out comes the poo, all down the ramp, lighting board, number plate ... :ill: :rolleyes:
But I bet your tomatoes are lurvly! :D

[charliedenny]

Several things bother me about some cyclists...

One, incorrect use of lighting, or no lighting at all, when driving you need to watch for everything around you, a cyclist without lights is so difficult to see, esp as they have a habbit of cutting down the inside of you as you are turning left, with clear indication.
The flashing rear light, great idea, but so many cyclist use this as the only means of lighting, bad idea, legally they still require to have a constant red light.

Cyclists not signally their intentions, and then getting upset with car drivers who go past them, namely the turning right situation.

Cyclists who do not obey the road markings, and swap lanes at random, crossing other traffic, including fellow cyclists, as they are only looking forward, and forget what is behind them... (seen too cyclists collide in front of me two days ago because of this... the one following had no chance to do anything but hit the other guy as it all happened far to quick, )

Cyclists in Edinburgh do not generally obey the traffic lights.. and cross when red, which can make turning etc difficult for you who do have the right to be travelling through the lights on a green light. (this the police seem to be clampping down on and have seen two cyclists pulled over by police cars for doing that)

We seem to have a culture of cyclists out there who seem to think they are above the law, I personally obey the rules when ever I am out on the road with my cycle, why can't these others. All they do is alienate all cyclists to all other road users. You can see it coming in the future the groups forming against cyclists in cities... this will happen is a cyclist causes the death of a child, and at the speeds of these cyclists go at down the hills in Edinburgh it may happen sooner rather than later here...


not only in edinburugh but also aberdeen
I met a kid on a bike at 7.30 pm last night no lights on an unlit mainroad
silly idiot!:eek:

[DEANO3528]

I'm sat here laughing at all the replies. Some interesting points raised, especially that I think g/laning should be banned :D
Let's be honest, if you can't take it, you shouldn't dish it out.

The bikes and insurance issue is important though.
I feel sorry for anyone who has been hit by any uninsured road user and has been left out of pocket, that shouldn't be allowed. I can't imagine the feeling of having a cyclist (for instance) colliding with the side of your pearlescent painted Beemer Z3, with no hope of recompense. After all, the rider could be anybody, as no documentary evidence is held either by vehicle logbook or any form of licence.

[Newsreader]

What about a pavement tax? When you buy a pair of shoes you have to reg them and put a plate on each one. All left shoes start with an L, all right shoes start with an R (that'll foil the terrorists and ne'erdo-wells :D ). Then it's off to the post office for your tax disc, which comes in two parts - you tear it in half and put one half on each shoe, that would prevent any attempts to cut and shut, say a good left (but stolen) shoe with a duff right shoe. MOT every year, check for tread depth, condition of leather and laces, and of course, emissions test on the inside ... there we are - sorted! Another kwango for Balir to open up ... :D

[Lighting90]

What about a pavement tax? When you buy a pair of shoes you have to reg them and put a plate on each one. All left shoes start with an L, all right shoes start with an R (that'll foil the terrorists and ne'erdo-wells :D ). Then it's off to the post office for your tax disc, which comes in two parts - you tear it in half and put one half on each shoe, that would prevent any attempts to cut and shut, say a good left (but stolen) shoe with a duff right shoe. MOT every year, check for tread depth, condition of leather and laces, and of course, emissions test on the inside ... there we are - sorted! Another kwango for Balir to open up ... :D

shhhh Mr Brown needs to think up new ways to earn money... esp if Blair gets kicked out and he becomes pm...

[charliedenny]

I spent two years in canada before I could drive and out there all pedal cycles had to registerd with the local council
if you did somthing wrong bang good old shanks pony! not good when you are 5 miles from pub!!

[mungo]

to be honest tho i dont really care if i mow someone on me bike, its their fault. :D


Lets hope you have the same atitude when you are run over by a motorist/trucker when riding your "Racing" bike with the legally required]reflectors removed. [:*****:

[J33P KN]

Tell you what i hate.. bloody roadies, riding two up on a 60mph dual carriageway. Its asking to get run down and tempting fate to say the least. There is a section just down the road from me where they do it on a regular basis. That and not wearing helmets.. then again i just hate roadies, being a Mtb'er.

[fisha]

i'm all for cycling in general and dont really think it should be taxed, and for some reason i dont see how you could force insure / tax a bike.


horses:

Should they be on the road? Not main ones i dont think. Foolish to do so unless the horse is exceptionally good in traffic and ridden by a very good rider and in the company of other horses. I see too many silly girls riding on the main roads with scatty horses round my way.

Horses should be insured if they are anywhere near other people and to not do so is foolish i think. The insurance generaly covers vet bills which are generally expensive ( think of your pet bill and at least double / triple it ) but ours also covers public liability ( upto £1m IIRC for each horse ). If my horse escapes if can do some serious damage. I've seen my horse plant 2 hooves on another and knock it clean off its feet. If it can do that to a 500kg horse, imaging what it could do to you at less than a 1/5th of that weight.

Horses aren't like a bike. I park up the bike and it stays there. I leave the horse, it goes off to do what i wants in the field. If it escapes there could be consequences. Its a different thing to a bike.

[Newsreader]

I think public liability insurance for horses should be compulsory, as you say fisha they can do a lot of damage. Vet's bills well that's up to the owner, if they want to put themselves in a position where they can't afford to keep their horse alive, that's their problem and nobody else's I suppose.

Main roads - depends what you mean by main road I guess. I would say dual carriageways aren't a great idea because of the traffic speeds, but on all other roads it must depend on the horse surely. Like you I've seen scatty lasses on scatty horses, just plain stupid. But equally we own and help out with some amazingly bomb-proof animals, who can cope with literally anything without batting an eyelid.

If there was a blanket ban on horses on 'main roads', it would be a downward spiral, a bit like the current proposed clampdown on 4x4s. There would be fewer places you could legally take your horse, and of course over time, fewer horses and riders would be able to learn how to cope with difficult situations, so standards of riding would drop, and there would be fewer bomb-proof horses. And perhaps most imprtantly of all, non-horsey drivers would have fewer opportunities to practise driving around horses, making them all the more dangerous when they do meet a horse.

Phew :D

[Snagger]

My opinion is that no-one should be able to use the road without being suitably qualified and documented. That includes riders and cyclists. All users should have to sit the highway code exam. All users should be insured (this would cost little for a bicycle, but would enable third part claims). All should be subject to heavy penalties for breaking the code (ie. riding on pavements, riding the wrong way in one-way systems, cutting up other traffic, running red lights, lack of high vis reflectors, lights at night, protective clothing/hats, etc), and bicylcles should be given an MoT equivalents, as so many have no brakes, dangerous tyres and no lights/refectors. It's time to stop making motorists responsible for the stupidity and selfishness of the average bike rider.

[rusty_wingnut]

Lets hope you have the same atitude when you are run over by a motorist/trucker when riding your "Racing" bike with the legally required]reflectors removed. [:*****:

steady mate no need to give the old W sign. bit out of context really

i'll forigve you for now

anyway no bike should have reg plates on it. thats crazy, insurance is crazy, why not enforce young people to go on training at schools etc, its all ive ever had. and ive never had a shunt yet or mowed any idiots in cycle lanes.

the only problem on roads is when dicks pull out on you when your motoring on your happy way trying to get from a to b on your pedally cycle. or off road race machine

off road bikes are sold throughout the world as mountain bikes, proper mountain bikes are void of reflectors etc. so what do you propose ban all off road bikes from the road??? how you gunna enforce that??? more jobs for the boys, another waste of public money? dont be daft, the education is the way foward.

also my off road race machine is in perfect condition with beter brakes than any car. i can stop from my max speed quicker than anyone. im not 100% pro cycling i do get mad when i see kids riding with no brakes etc. but i do feel you cant force people to pay for their freedom, and a bike is the cheapest mode of transport for youngsters and its environmentally friendly, think if every young person rode to school, how much better our country would be.

don't discourage them, educate them

[shrek]

If there was a blanket ban on horses on 'main roads', it would be a downward spiral, a bit like the current proposed clampdown on 4x4s.

No, Ban 'em

Horses should be banned from all roads!! They were designed to be driven off road and that is were they belong. You more than often see only one person travelling on one and they take up too much room on the road. They are slow an cumbersome. The emmissions are obnoxious and the exhaust is mounted dangerously high for children in the vicinity. They are difficult to reverse. They should also be banned from all public rights of way because I don't like them. The drivers sit high up and look down on me which I feel is threatening. Perhaps they are making up for some inadequacy! Also I can't afford one, but I'm not jealous.
Pedal cycles are an environmently freindly alternative with none of the aforementioned emmissions. You have no less pleasure in riding a bike than a horse.
Also ban them off road because I think they leave hoof marks all over because I have seen horse riding on the telly and it sometimes gets a bit muddy.
Please sign my campaign which I will be sending to god to stop making such creatures.
Shrek :D :D :D

[Newsreader]

:LAA: Had me worried there Shrek, when I started reading your post :D

[fisha]

Snagger,

totally unworkable.

i tend to agree with the comments on better education.

[Snagger]

S
i tend to agree with the comments on better education.

Trouble is, it's been tried and failed miserably, like the rest of education. Most kids these days just want to look cool, not learn anything useful.

[charliedenny]

aggreed I had trouble with one kid doing some damage to my car I caught him at it I went and told his mum and dad who asked him why he did it he obvuisly denide it!
saw him in the village a couple of days later and said to him in front of his mates If I caught him again I would A) call the police B) call his parents and c) make him pay for any damage he did.
He went sheet white and couldn't look me in the eye. his mates who have a bit more sense told him to behave himself at that point he apoligised little toe rag!

[Lighting90]

Some interesting comments so far....

With regard to insurance, this is not as restrict or unworkable as you may think, a lot of people will already take out insurance on the bike for theft as part of your household policy. No reason why this policy could not be extended to third party cover, and the insurance companies even offering fully comp either via the household insurance policy. This would mean that the 12 year old would be insured without having to pay themselves.
Secondly, they could do it as a cover for all bikes owned in the family, like a blanket cover rather than for individual bikes, a bit like business fleet insurance. Very simple and effective, and if people are given this chance of different levels of insurance via the houshold insurance, the uptake most likely would be higher, as costs would be spread over the 12 months rather than having a lump sum to be paid.

With regard to number plates, you could never introduce a number plate system like we have for motorised vehicles, (can you imagine the paperwork filing for claiming the date of manufacturer etc, for those special custom mountain bikes...) But a numberplate system could be introduced as a simple identify, with a reduction on your insurance. This would mean simply you could have a plate which has anything on it, as long as it is registered on a data base to you the owner, and that way you could swap it from bike to bike you own, and it could be things like "Hellboy" or whatever you wish, providing you are the first to register it on the national register. This sort of freedom of choice for the plates and discount would mean that setting a compulsory system would not be needed in the same way as cars. They could even break it down to having the counties on the plate so you could have Hellboy in several counties, expanding the possibilities and choice for people. It would be seen more as a fun thing to do rather than been told, this is what you have to do.
I would think also, if you go to the lenghts of having your personalised number plate on your push bike, you will tend to take more care on the road anyway, which would help justify the reduced insurance cover payments. Could even say this one could actually be lead by insurance companies rather than the government. The insurance companies could be encouraged again to offer reduced payments if you take an advanced rider training course, which again, if displayed on your bike, most kids would be proud to have, which would help with the eductaion training.

At present the feeling I am picking up is that people are getting sick of been told what to do by the government, which is why if it can be done in a different way it might work better..

[rusty_wingnut]

i'd roll with that

[DEANO3528]

Nice idea Lightning90.
My Dad had to have number plate, tax disc and take his cycle to the local policeman for an annual check when he was a boy in ZA, 70 years ago! Mind you they also had motorways before the war too.

[shrek]

Here's my bike that requires a registration plate, tax disk (duty exempt), driving licence, mot and lights. ;)

[rusty_wingnut]

ok heres a question should cycle lanes have seperate speed limits???

[shrek]

ok heres a question should cycle lanes have seperate speed limits???
Of course, but only if they can have speed camera's too. ;) :D

[rusty_wingnut]

my mission in life is to trip a speed camera on the pedally wheels.

in all seriousness tho some cyclists have little regard for the speed limit so long as we get up the next hill.

Of course all road users should obey the limit. but should cycle lanes have seperate speed limits, so if the road is a 40mph the bike lane is limited to 30 or give them the same?? its a question i got from cycling in groups and realising we were going quicker than cars at some points.