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Thread: Freelander Losing Water

  1. #1

    Unhappy Freelander Losing Water

    Hi, my 2002 1800 is losing water, and I am hoping it isn't the head gasket. There appears to be no oil in the expansion bottle and no water in the oil. I have taken off the expansion bottle which has splits in it, and it was wet around it. Could the problem be as easy as replacing this or do I have more to worry about. Anyone have any ideas? THANKS...

  2. #2
    Defender of the Forum. TEMPL4R's Avatar
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    Default Re: Freelander Losing Water

    Expansion bottles crack, water pumps leak down the bottom of the front timing cover and the pipe at the back of the engine to the pump, rots and leaks.

    Chris
    ........Such are they, whom God chooses for Himself, and gathers from the furthest ends of the Earth, servants from among the bravest, in Israel, to guard watchfully and faithfully, His sepulchre and the Temple of Solomon, sword in hand, ready for battle.
    YCHJCYA2PDTHFH and PhD Hons Drvl Cleckheaton and Grand Master of the Forum Lodge of Enlightenment

    Everyone is entitled to their opinion, the trouble is, yours is ridiculous.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Freelander Losing Water

    Thanks I'll try the bottle first.

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    Default Re: Freelander Losing Water

    You could also check the gasket in your inlet manifold, I quess it's plastic the same as my 97 1.8, takes about 15mins, but get a new gasket first, I bought a complete head gasket set and bolts for mine, started to dismantle the head, when I took the inlet manifold of I noticed that there was a water outlet on the head but was a blanked off chamber on the manifold and the only thing seperating the blanked off chamber from the inlet port is the gasket which is tubular shaped and fits in a slot in the manifold, and on mine it showed signs of water both sides of it, I must add at this point, before I changed my gasket it would keep loosing a bit of water regular then nothing for months but would only go down just below the bottom of the reservoir bottle. Another quick check is the plugs, If 1 of them is pitted (rusty) at the bottom of the thread, and can be difficult to get out if left for to long. This is a sign your engine is sucking in water, It will rot your exhaust and you will notice excess steam from your exhaust, It could have a cracked head of course but unless it has actualy boiled over, then this is unlikley. I thought it was only the earlier freelanders and the old rovers 214's that had this problem, but I quess not.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Freelander Losing Water

    The water bottle appeared to have solved the problem with not a drop of water being lost. Then 3 weeks later temperatire guage shot up bottle empty and mayo all over the place. I would say 100% that the HG has now gone. Does anyone know how likely it is I will be able to save the head and just get it skimmed, or will it be cracked and have to be replaced? Also is there anything else I should be scared of adding to the cost here. Thanks.

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    Default Re: Freelander Losing Water

    I've never had one cracked, just skimmed and refitted with the modified gasket set.

    If you only do short runs and never really get the engine warmed up, it's worth fitting the modified thermostat and hoses if you haven't got them already. (a big whitish lump with 3 hoses to it, to the right of the engine, behind the radiator) but do remember to take the other one out. Believe me, it happens...

    Chris
    ........Such are they, whom God chooses for Himself, and gathers from the furthest ends of the Earth, servants from among the bravest, in Israel, to guard watchfully and faithfully, His sepulchre and the Temple of Solomon, sword in hand, ready for battle.
    YCHJCYA2PDTHFH and PhD Hons Drvl Cleckheaton and Grand Master of the Forum Lodge of Enlightenment

    Everyone is entitled to their opinion, the trouble is, yours is ridiculous.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Freelander Losing Water

    Chris, Many thanks I will let the garage know about that and let you know how I get on, fingers crossed. Simon.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Freelander Losing Water

    Hi, My 02 1.8 GS Freelander blew a HG at 38k, early signs were combustion gasses in coolant (tested for on 36k service).
    Vehicle showed no signs of cross contamination or water loss before she blew.
    Fixed now at LR Maindealer, total cost £ 600 inc vat.
    They fitted the new modified HG introduced in 2005 LVB 500190 & also the prrt thermostat has been changed from the cream canister which opens at 76 degrees with medium spring, for the grey canister which opens at 72 deg with a weaker spring. This has stopped the engine getting hot so rapidly from start up, which im sure has contributed to many HG failures.
    The only thing i am slightly worried about now is, i read on some forum about a modified oil ladder LCN000140L which it said must be fitted in conjunction with modified HG. It is positioned in the sump and the head bolts pass right down through the block and screw into this oil ladder, and it was suggesting if not fitted, in time head bolts may loosen to less than the required torque and result in HGF.
    Does anyone know if this is true, & should the landrover dealer have fitted this part?

  9. #9

    Default Re: Freelander Losing Water

    There was I thinking that all was well. I received a €480.00 bill for the head gasket repair and head skim, which I thought was reasonable. All was fine for a week, and then oil and water mixed again with the good old mayo back in the engine. Back to garage and they have now told me that on taking everything apart the thermostat is not working and although the water was circulating around the engine due to the thermostat it was not going through the rad. Sounds starnge to me, and wish I had argued more and got them to do the thermostat first time around. Anyway they have taken the thermostat out of the housing and are running the car as I write and say all looks well. My question is that they are recomending leaving the thermostat out all together and say that this is pefectly OK, is this true? Also on seeing the car running I said I thought it seemed to run very warm in the engine bay and that the fans didn't come on often and when they did seemed pretty slow, even though they were throwing hot air out. Should my fans be running faster and should they be cutting in sooner. The temperature guage on the dash doesn't move when it gets to half way. Any thoughts advise would be much appreciated.

    Thanks


    Simon

  10. #10

    Default Re: Freelander Losing Water

    Has your vehicle had the the thermostat conversion? ie old thermostat removed from side of head & blanking plate fitted, then a cannister which contains the prrt thermostat fitted to rad hoses(3 hoses connected)?
    Why do they want to leave thermostat out? the latest LR thermostat is grey in colour & opens at a lower temperture to the cream cannister & at lower pressure. This is what you need to be fitted, it stops the engine getting hot so quickly from start up, then colder rad water causing thermal shock to the head.
    Your engine is designed to run at a certain operating tempreture, yes the car will run with a removed thermostat but could run like a bag of p**h from startup especially in winter.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Freelander Losing Water

    From your discription, the fans sound fine, although without looking at the vehicle it is hard to judge. Most vehicles fans dont come on as quickly as you think they should & they dont run constantly or for as long as you would expect.
    An engine bay is always a warm place when the engines running, so dont let that worry you. If your fans are not doing their job, you will see your temp gauge rising, especially when vehicle is stationary, use that as your guide, needle is normally bang in the centre.
    One thing that is worth checking after HGF on the k series is the water pump for leaks as it has a rubber seal and not a gasket, that seals it to the block. After the engine has over heated it can damage the seal causing it to leak, keep a daily eye on the expansion bottle level & if top up is neccesary, remove pully shield behind o/s/f wheel & look for drips to left of crank pully when starting from cold.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Freelander Losing Water

    Thanks for the comments/information. The thermostat I am talking about is the one that is in a plastic housing towards the front of the engine bay and has I believe 3 pipes going into it, but it is not directly attached to the engine. Are there 2 thermostats? I drove it a few miles and must admit it is running far too cold now, you don't even get warm air out of the heaters, so when this is over I will get it replaced. Could the rubber seal on the water pump cause water to mix with the oil in the engine? I am still getting mayonnaise even though I am being told the the HG is fine and pressure tests show all to well. Has anyone got any other thoughts on how the water might be getting in. Many Thanks.

    Simon

  13. #13

    Default Re: Freelander Losing Water

    Hi, There is only one thermostat. Before the modification the thermostat was positioned on the side of the engine, when modification was carried out this would have been removed and replaced with a blanking cover.
    You have the modified (prrt) pressure relief remote thermostat (canister type). Originally this was cream in colour, now LR are fitting a grey colour canister which contains a different thermostat which opens at a lower temperture, this thermostat is also pressure sensitive so will open when coolant reaches a certain pressure. THIS GREY CANISTER IS WHAT YOU NEED TO FIT. An easy 30 min job, make sure coolant system is bleed properly to get all air out of system.
    Where is your mayo, if there is no oil in your expansion bottle or blobs of water on your dip stick, but just mayo when you take oil filler cap off, sounds like the engine breather pipe is blocked. Remove and clear.
    A damaged water pump seal would not mix the water with the oil.
    Was the engine flushed properly to remove all contaminates when head gasket was replaced?
    Did the repairer replace with the modified head gasket, as i know the previous gasket is still available if parts are purchased from some motor factors.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Freelander Losing Water

    Thanks again. I will ensure the new one that is fitted is grey thermostat. The engine was fully flushed out after HG done, and yes the modifed one was fitted with all new bolts etc. There is no oil in the expansion bottle it seems to only be in the engine with it on dipstick and in oil filler cap. I will check out the breather pipe. Someone aslo said could be either the block ot the wetliners. Anyone got any thoughts on this?

    Thanks


    Simon

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Freelander Losing Water

    Whenever you do a head gasket, you always change the thermostat. It needs one refitting or it will not reach running temperature and the heater will always be cold.

    The K series need a few good flushes and we run some detergent in the water for a couple of days, flush and detergent again, then ask the owner to come back for another flush and oil change in about 300 miles.
    We have found that old engine oil for about half an hour, (w no point in asting good flushing oil first time) then fresh oil and filter, plus the change after 300 miles seems to clean the system out very well.

    They can really take some cleaning if emulsion is in the oil and water system.

    Chris
    ........Such are they, whom God chooses for Himself, and gathers from the furthest ends of the Earth, servants from among the bravest, in Israel, to guard watchfully and faithfully, His sepulchre and the Temple of Solomon, sword in hand, ready for battle.
    YCHJCYA2PDTHFH and PhD Hons Drvl Cleckheaton and Grand Master of the Forum Lodge of Enlightenment

    Everyone is entitled to their opinion, the trouble is, yours is ridiculous.

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